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 Post subject: Re: Privacy Policy requirement
Unread postPosted: Sat Feb 25, 2017 9:23 am 
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Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2012 9:53 am
Posts: 2797
Location: Colorado, U.S.
mougino wrote:
Hi Marc and welcome back!
Hi Nicolas, and hi everybody! I have missed you.

mougino wrote:
Out of the nine apps I published on the Play store (all of them based on RFO BASIC!) I received a mail only for the BASIC! Compiler from Google, because it uses READ_PHONE_STATE (BASIC! command DEVICE.INFO).
That's good news. It is surprising. READ_EXTERNAL_STORAGE and WRITE_EXTERNAL_STORAGE are among the "dangerous" permissions that get special handling in Android 6.0+. I assumed all the "dangerous" permissions were also "sensitive" permissions. I will investigate more.

The BASIC! Editor uses external storage to save and load programs. When you compile an app, you load the program from assets -- that is not external storage. However, if your game saves scores or other state in external storage, you need those permissions.

I think that means it is now very important to give BASIC! programmers an easy way to use internal storage.

In this commit on GitHub, I added DEVICE.LANGUAGE and DEVICE.LOCALE commands. I think the purpose was allow you to get language and locale without READ_PHONE_STATE permission. That was back in June, so I'm not sure. Sorry, it will take me a while to get back up to speed.

mougino wrote:
I came up with this privacy policy: http://mougino.free.fr/com.rfo.compiler_privacy_policy.txt for the Compiler.
If other users were asked by Google to write a privacy policy, you can take mine as inspiration, I won't mind.
Thank you!

- Marc


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 Post subject: Re: Privacy Policy requirement
Unread postPosted: Sat Feb 25, 2017 9:46 am 
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Location: Colorado, U.S.
QBFan wrote:
If the my application does NOT read device identification, and tel. number etc, and does not send anything anywhere, then even necessary privacy policy?
If your application asks for those permissions, Google Play requires a privacy policy. If you don't use them, the policy has to say you don't use them.

So if you don't use the permissions, you should remove them from your application. Then you don't need a policy.

You request permissions by listing them in the file "AndroidManifest.xml". If you're using Eclipse or Android Studio, you can just remove them. The builder tools should have a way to select permissions; I believe mougino's QuickAPK has an advanced settings screen for such things.

- Marc


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 Post subject: Re: Privacy Policy requirement
Unread postPosted: Sat Feb 25, 2017 12:49 pm 
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Joined: Wed Apr 15, 2015 3:57 am
Posts: 440
Welcome Back!!!!!!!


So far Google has been gentle with me. I posted my privacy notice on my Wordpress page and put the link the Play store listing and they haven't bothered me since. I still have to put the privacy notice inside each app that uses the microphone which is going to be a pain.

I'm no lawyer, but feel free to adapt mine to your needs if you'd like:

https://festivusparty.com/privacy-notice/

Chris


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 Post subject: Re: Privacy Policy requirement
Unread postPosted: Sat Feb 25, 2017 3:07 pm 
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Joined: Sat Oct 04, 2014 5:45 am
Posts: 642
Marc wrote:
So if you don't use the permissions, you should remove them from your application. Then you don't need a policy.
Marc wrote:
The builder tools should have a way to select permissions; I believe mougino's QuickAPK has an advanced settings screen for such things.

I confirm that the permissions can also be selected in RFO2APK when making an APK.
It must also be noted that if your app needs a permission but you do not select such
permission then your app will fail to work as intended.

Image

Emile

_________________
Download and tutorial for RFODESIGNER
https://sites.google.com/site/rfodesigner/


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 Post subject: Re: Privacy Policy requirement
Unread postPosted: Sun Feb 26, 2017 5:39 am 
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Joined: Sat Dec 08, 2012 2:14 am
Posts: 1135
Location: From Blighty
Welcome back Marc and Nicolas, hello strangers...

I don't have a developer account at the Play Store.

A point to add would be, if not thought of already as within the BASIC! app,  we have a redirect to Bintray under 'About'. And with program example f00a_download_manual.bas for  the manual. Maybe that should be included in the Data Privacy Policy?

As well as f00_v01_90_read_me.bas has a reference to the rfobasic.freeforums.org

Program f39_downloader accesses laughton.com so does Paul's server also falls into those realms too?

Should some dissociation with third-party apps written with BASIC! included in the clause?

Perhaps from the obvious email some other contact point, via snail mail too?

It seems Google have got the duster out for Spring...

Mog

Disclaimer: Any programs I may have written that resemble 1980's 8-bit clones living or dead is purely coincidental.


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 Post subject: Re: Privacy Policy requirement
Unread postPosted: Sun Feb 26, 2017 9:52 am 
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Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2012 9:53 am
Posts: 2797
Location: Colorado, U.S.
RSA wrote:
I confirm that the permissions can also be selected in RFO2APK when making an APK.
Thank you for the confirmation. Also for the reminder that RFODESIGNER includes RFO2APK. Please understand that I don't know the various designer tools well because I never use any of them. I have never published a BASIC! program. Rather a sad oversight.

RSA wrote:
It must also be noted that if your app needs a permission but you do not select such permission then your app will fail to work as intended.
Yes, which gets us back to the DEVICE command I mentioned yesterday.

QBFan may be using DEVICE as Nicolas does, to get language and locale. In that case he should not need PHONE permissions, but must have them because the DEVICE command also reports things like your phone number.

I think I had better get out a test build. Daniel (@dtrieb) asked me about that a couple of days ago, but he was satisfied with my promise to get v01.91 out in a couple of weeks. I'll cut v01.90.02 so anybody using DEVICE for language and locale can remove PHONE permissions from your apps. (v0.90.01 came out last June so Alberto could test the new WakeLock flag.)

EDIT: No need for v01.90.02 because DEVICE.LANGUAGE and DEVICE.LOCALE are already in v01.90.01 (Basic_19001.apk). See this post.

- Marc


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 Post subject: Re: Privacy Policy requirement
Unread postPosted: Sun Feb 26, 2017 10:15 am 
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Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2012 9:53 am
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Location: Colorado, U.S.
Mog wrote:
A point to add would be, if not thought of already as within the BASIC! app,  we have a redirect to Bintray under 'About'. And with program example f00a_download_manual.bas for  the manual. Maybe that should be included in the Data Privacy Policy?
Uffda! The sample programs. Yes, those must be included in the BASIC! app privacy policy, too. f15_gps.bas knows where you are... Sincere, if somewhat rueful, thanks for reminder, Mog.

A new look for the Mogatar, I see. Vaguely familiar. Hanna-Barbera? A new puzzle (my fingers typed that as "pussle").
Love the disclaimer!

The privacy policy isn't about where you get data from. Linking to Bintray, Github, or laughton.com is not a problem unless you send user data to those places. Unless, of course, the place you get data from records the fact that you got it. Then whose privacy policy applies?

Chris's policy has a great example: if you use voice recognition, your voice is recorded (anonymously) on a Google server. His policy tells the user that happens, and links to Google's privacy policy.

I suppose it's obvious, but I'll also say that the privacy policy is needed only for apps on Google Play store. It is not needed for apps uploaded to Paul's server.

Paul used to publish BASIC! on Amazon's store, too. I don't have the keys to do that. I wonder if Amazon will also kick out apps without privacy policies?

- Marc


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 Post subject: Re: Privacy Policy requirement
Unread postPosted: Mon Feb 27, 2017 12:09 am 
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Posts: 1135
Location: From Blighty
It's Gargamel's cat from The Smurfs! ... The little blighter! It was the byte out the ear reference I was thinking of! Not the unpleasantness of that cat! Some nostalgia too... When my dad went to fill up with gas on our long holidays, we'd get a tiny plastic smurf to collect!

I know there are free policy generators. As far as I know, Google won't give much pointers. Other than the searchable obvious we can do though, but nothing I can find from Google to assist?

My search results came up lacklustre but I'll put them here:-

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.xda- ... -15th/amp/

^ Covers what you stated already.

https://support.google.com/googleplay/a ... 0602?hl=en

^ Marshmallow reference

https://www.truste.com

https://www.freeprivacypolicy.com

^ Doesn't mention Play Store policies though.

http://supercell.com/en/privacy-policy/

The last one is an over zealous one I think... But this has given me some pointers for my previous post.

Amazon I can only draw a blank, hopefully someone that has an app there will post here...

Mog


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 Post subject: Re: Privacy Policy requirement
Unread postPosted: Tue Feb 28, 2017 8:04 am 
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Posts: 2797
Location: Colorado, U.S.
Azrael! The memory is getting really creaky.

I was not aware of policy generators. That's a rather bizarre concept. Thanks for the research.


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 Post subject: Re: Privacy Policy requirement
Unread postPosted: Tue Feb 28, 2017 8:11 am 
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Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2012 9:53 am
Posts: 2797
Location: Colorado, U.S.
And, speaking of creaky memory...

I got all the way through the considerable effort of figuring what's on the GitHub repository now and writing the change list and links for the v01.90.02 release post, when I realized that there was nothing about the DEVICE changes you need to avoid permissions problems! Yeah, those were already built into v01.90.01.

But there is no v01.90.01 on Paul's server. The file is called Basic_19001.new2016.apk. I don't think I did that. Can somebody tell me what it is?

- Marc


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